So this EU thing

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Re: So this EU thing

Postby ssane max » Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:20 am

Macunaima wrote:Yer all a bunch of hobbits. :D


I suspect B2B is a Ruffian.
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Re: So this EU thing

Postby Bronshtein » Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:33 am

I'm not sure whether the 'Hobbit' motif is an amusing affectation on you part, Mac, or a wider American (white USA) pseudo-anthropological delusion, but a fantasy book written by a fifty year old Oxford Don, 70 odd years ago, offers no more practical or accurate insight into current British/English cultural values and ethnicity than Miracle on 34th Street (the novella or film - 1947) does into the current Trumpian dystopia.

Probably less. At least rampant consumerism is alive and well in the USA. I doubt however, that the US Post Office would be adjudged a final arbiter on the existence of Father Christmas in 2020.

As a basis for an exploration of change - perhaps, but I suspect there are as few 'real' Hobbits left in the shires in the UK as there are heart warming US postal workers with time to drive thousands of letters to an old man in a committal hearing in New York.

Meanwhile; dePfeffel and Ursula decide to give it another go for the sake of the kids.
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Re: So this EU thing

Postby Picador » Sun Oct 04, 2020 12:02 pm

Bronshtein wrote:I'm not sure whether the 'Hobbit' motif is an amusing affectation on you part, Mac, or a wider American (white USA) pseudo-anthropological delusion, but a fantasy book written by a fifty year old Oxford Don, 70 odd years ago, offers no more practical or accurate insight into current British/English cultural values and ethnicity than Miracle on 34th Street (the novella or film - 1947) does into the current Trumpian dystopia.

Probably less. At least rampant consumerism is alive and well in the USA. I doubt however, that the US Post Office would be adjudged a final arbiter on the existence of Father Christmas in 2020.

As a basis for an exploration of change - perhaps, but I suspect there are as few 'real' Hobbits left in the shires in the UK as there are heart warming US postal workers with time to drive thousands of letters to an old man in a committal hearing in New York.

Meanwhile; dePfeffel and Ursula decide to give it another go for the sake of the kids.



I think he means we're all stunty, hairy footed troglodytes with a peculiar culture. With bad teeth of course.

Or he could just have been hitting the pipeweed.
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Re: So this EU thing

Postby Bollocks to Brexit » Sun Oct 04, 2020 2:57 pm

ssane max wrote:
Macunaima wrote:Yer all a bunch of hobbits. :D


I suspect B2B is a Ruffian.


Probably, but I have no idea what you are on about.
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Re: So this EU thing

Postby Bronshtein » Sun Oct 04, 2020 4:01 pm

I believe he suspects you are fibbing, are a bounder and generally 'not one of us'.

I may well be wrong - often am with abstruse allusions - but I offer the thought, with no suggestion I attach myself to the sentiment.
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Re: So this EU thing

Postby sssane max » Mon Oct 05, 2020 7:04 am

Bronshtein wrote:I believe he suspects you are fibbing, are a bounder and generally 'not one of us'.

I may well be wrong - often am with abstruse allusions - but I offer the thought, with no suggestion I attach myself to the sentiment.


I make a 'Lord of the Rings' reference on here and you call it abstruse??? Ruffians, man.

I have just started painting a new Dragon Rampant army - The Halfling Democratic Republic - where the Decadent Gondorist Running Dogs lost the Battle of The Brandywine and the Shire is the North Korea of Middle earth, with our Fraternal 8-legged friends from Mirkwood fighting alongside Halflings with lots of Trumpets and an evil Tree (Tree-34) from the Old Forest. But Ruffians feature heavily.
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Re: So this EU thing

Postby Bronshtein » Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:58 am

There you go - an abstruse reference :D
Last read Tolkien's rambling, twee, overlong, repressed homosexual tome 49 years ago and have not seen a reason to revisit it. So thank you for clearing that up.

Mostly what I remember is what a cunt Tom Bombadil was for not sorting the whole fucking thing out and saving us all that trek and wondering when Sam and Frodo would finally commit.

The final bit - scouring of the Shire? - seemed a weird tying of loose ends which might be an Anglo-Saxon/Norse Saga requirement but didn't sit well in the narrative structure. (or I may have just been too knackered after all that twaddle to appreciate it).
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Re: So this EU thing

Postby Bollocks to Brexit » Mon Oct 05, 2020 1:30 pm

Bronshtein wrote:I believe he suspects you are fibbing, are a bounder and generally 'not one of us'.

I may well be wrong - often am with abstruse allusions - but I offer the thought, with no suggestion I attach myself to the sentiment.


Meh! Whatever.
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Re: So this EU thing

Postby Bollocks to Brexit » Mon Oct 05, 2020 1:51 pm

Bronshtein wrote:There you go - an abstruse reference :D
Last read Tolkien's rambling, twee, overlong, repressed homosexual tome 49 years ago and have not seen a reason to revisit it. So thank you for clearing that up.

Mostly what I remember is what a cunt Tom Bombadil was for not sorting the whole fucking thing out and saving us all that trek and wondering when Sam and Frodo would finally commit.

The final bit - scouring of the Shire? - seemed a weird tying of loose ends which might be an Anglo-Saxon/Norse Saga requirement but didn't sit well in the narrative structure. (or I may have just been too knackered after all that twaddle to appreciate it).


I read it two or three times as a teenager and enjoyed it; I tried reading it again a few years ago and found myself wondering what sort of utter arse I must have been as a teenager.

However, I am not convinced by your claim that it is a "repressed homosexual tome"; isn't 'tome' somewhat Kileyesque? It is very much in the mould of the Victorian/Edwardian adventure yarns which influenced Tolkien.

Even as a teenager, the scouring of the Shire section always struck me as odd as well; however, as you note, it does fit the "hero returns home to find everything has gone to fuck" scenario common among the sagas.
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Re: So this EU thing

Postby Bronshtein » Mon Oct 05, 2020 2:00 pm

And you think Victorian/Edwardian ripping yarns with smooth cheeked yet plucky boy soldier heroes aren't full of repressed homosexual longing?

I've been reading and using the word 'tome' since at least the early 1960s. I see no reason to abandon it now. Especially if it would mean surrendering it to the clutches of the writer of 'I Love Lucy' Napoleonic fan fiction
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