Shooting rampage master thread

[gloria_invictus]

So it's not at all about availability, but about personal responsibility. Both families have the heroin available, but only one is addicted to it. So let's punish both.

I'm not sure you understood the analogy.

Many people argue that the free availability of guns is not the cause of gun violence in the states. They point to Canada as an example, where there are roughly as many guns per capita as in the States, but a much lower rate of gun violence.

As far as I'm concerned, Canada is the house next door in the analogy. It doesn't matter to me that the boy next door is not addicted. I'm not going to leave the piles of heroin around in my house, so my daughter can use it, just because the boy next door is not using. You wouldn't either.

Blaming guns for mass shootings is like blaming forks for obesity. It throws personal responsibility out the window in a knee jerk reaction.

That's a cute analogy, but it's not exactly on point, as obesity is really a matter of personal responsibility. Gun violence is not a matter of personal responsibility, it is a matter of public safety, a very different issue.

Guns didn't kill those kids at Sandy Hook, Adam Lanza did.

Oh please, not that again. The gun killed the children. He murdered 26 people in ten minutes. This would never have been possible without the bushmaster.

you damn American hater you!

I always love the "guns don't kill people, people kill people thought." what a joke.

[Duff]

Yes well, some cunt thought it would be a laugh to start it up again :roll

Once upon a time you could rely on the Frothpot to cheer you up, but half the time it's just used for political posturing now

Down with this sort of thing.

You could always take the advice I've seen you offer others on several occasions Woody, don't read the thread.

I'm not interested in the GW rip off thread but instead of repeatedly making posts decrying that others do and continue to post, I just don't bother reading it.

[Citizen Sade]

... would you get rid of the piles?

Feel free to remove the piles in your house. Expect a rather different response in you want to force me to do the same in mine.

... there are about ten about a child who shot himself or another kid playing with dad's self-defence firearm, or a man who shot his wife thinking she was an intruder ...

The first type of tragedy is easily solved by responsible gun owners keeping their firearms under lock and key. The second should never happen if the shooter has undertaken and understood basic gun safety training.

Ironically, on the day of the Sandy Hook shootings, the NRA's twitter account posted a link to a story about a woman who had prevented a robbery in her beauty salon because she was armed. They posted in the story the hashtag #armedcitizen. As they were posting that, another "armed citizen" was carrying on with his own gun use.

Would you prevent her from defending herself and her property because a citizen with mental problems and his murdered mother's weapons went on a rampage? Better, surely, to do what we can to keep firearms out of the hands of the mentally ill?

[Clayface]

[quote="Citizen Sade Better, surely, to do what we can to keep firearms out of the hands of the mentally ill?[/quote]

some sort of questionnaire?

Q1 - Do you really, really want a gun? Yes/No
A - Yes = Fail

[TMeier]

?but the point remains.

Well first it would be a better analogy to use alcohol as the addictive substance because it, like guns, is legal. If my child were an alcoholic I would certainly get rid of or secure the alcohol in my home and then I would try and get to the root cause of her addiction. I wouldn?t forbid alcohol to my other children, (though I would forbid them to give her any) much less my neighbors. Like I said, I don?t think the analogy is a very complete one.

Crime rates in the states don't really support the notion that gun ownership suppresses crime.

I don?t know. Certainly the facts don?t all point in one direction. I don?t spend a lot of time researching it but what I have read from both sides is deeply flawed.

Anecdotes don?t mean much but I can tell you this from my own experience. In 1990 I bought a factory building in one of the rougher areas of Cincinnati. I was fitting the top floor with an office and apartment but had not yet moved in when there was a burglary. Fortunately the break-in was seen and reported and the police apprehended the man. I had to go to court to formally testify I didn?t know him and he did not have my permission the be on the premises. While waiting to testify I was sitting with the two cops who made the arrest. They told me the burglar had just been released on parole, seems he was a double murderer who had beaten his stepson to death and knifed a man in a bar.

I didn?t own any guns at that time though I was familiar with them from youth when my family lived on the edge of the countryside. I went and bought a shotgun, then later a revolver.

The building was constantly being broken into even though it was a veritable fortress, twice while I was there. There were at least two attempts a month for nearly a year. Then on one occasion when I heard a noise downstairs I put the revolver in my belt and went to investigate. I met a man coming up the stairs (he as at the bottom of a narrow stairwell about thirty feet away to start). He told me his car had run out of gas and would I give him some money. I asked him how he got in but instead of answering he started to climb the stars saying he just wanted to talk to me. I drew the pistol, holding it in front of me pointed at the floor and told him to leave the building now. He protested he just wanted to talk, said I was ?crazy? and left.

I was in that building for nine more years and I never had another break-in or as far as I could tell an attempted break-in.

Like I said anecdotes don?t mean much and I don?t think of this as any sort of evidence but neither do I think an impression gathered from the news media is worth much. What?s needed is a systematic survey and no one seems to have any interest in providing one.

[General Paranoia]

Yes well, some cunt thought it would be a laugh to start it up again :roll

Once upon a time you could rely on the Frothpot to cheer you up, but half the time it's just used for political posturing now

Down with this sort of thing.

You could always take the advice I've seen you offer others on several occasions Woody, don't read the thread.

I'm not interested in the GW rip off thread but instead of repeatedly making posts decrying that others do and continue to post, I just don't bother reading it.

It's not like you were particularly involved in the thread either, but...

Now, where were we?

...and it's up and running again and being used as much as a soapbox for a certain amount of Political bollocks, Anti-US and racist twaddle than it's being used to discuss it's purported subject matter (Mass shootings rather than general gun crime and gun control in the US)
None of this is getting anyone anywhere other than to stir up bad feelings between forum members which seems to be the main agenda for some of the posters here.
Frothers used to be far more of a multicultural environment than it is now. The "them and us" used to be more to do with wargaming attitudes than politics and Nationality.
I really am getting quite disillusioned with all this. Frothers was a place for fun, somewhere to get away from all the shit life flings at us. You could take the piss out of someone but it was because they acted like a prat not because of where they came from or who they voted for.
These threads are very divisive for Frothers as a forum and the usual banter is turning nastier.
Just ignoring them isn't the answer Duff, as it's spilling over into other threads.

[redzed]

Frothers used to be far more of a multicultural environment than it is now. The "them and us" used to be more to do with wargaming attitudes than politics and Nationality.
I really am getting quite disillusioned with all this. Frothers was a place for fun, somewhere to get away from all the shit life flings at us. You could take the piss out of someone but it was because they acted like a prat not because of where they came from or who they voted for.
These threads are very divisive for Frothers as a forum and the usual banter is turning nastier.
Just ignoring them isn't the answer Duff, as it's spilling over into other threads.

Amen Brother Wooly Beard

[Bumblebee]

Who was doing all the Hallelujah!bollocks? We need him back to save us from the darkness and anger engulfing Frothers.

[fear_the_squirrels]

These threads are very divisive for Frothers as a forum and the usual banter is turning nastier.
Just ignoring them isn't the answer Duff, as it's spilling over into other threads.

Politics and religion are the quickest way to start a fight. Which 'Merica will win, cause we are heavily armed. Cue eagle super-imposed over a waving American flag.

-TOC

[AKULA]

These threads are very divisive for Frothers as a forum and the usual banter is turning nastier.
Just ignoring them isn't the answer .... as it's spilling over into other threads.

Yup.

Maybe we should put Condo in the wickerman that Steders has been building behind the shed?